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Fast Mover Activation Chance

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Guardian

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Re: Fast Mover Activation Chance

PostWed Apr 13, 2016 7:50 pm

I'm thinking one squad of infantry should be assigned to one squad of fast movers. They act kind of like transports. In order for the FM to get the benefit, the infantry must be on the board (in a building? Proper visualization of the battlefield?). If the squad is not on the board, their respective FM loses the bonus. If that squad of infantry dies, the FM will never have the bonus for the game.

Maybe even require the FAC squad draw line of sight onto the majority of the group their FM was targeting. It allows people to tactically deny some potential use of FM.

The fluff would be easily adapted to that too
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SwordOfJustice

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Re: Fast Mover Activation Chance

PostThu Apr 14, 2016 1:23 am

Nice ideas!

On a related point, I always wanted UCM Praetorian Snipers to function as FAC but they're getting a new infiltration special rule, so that's good enough in my books. We probably wouldn't want scouts in a special battlegroup with fast movers or it would be too good.
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chrisloomis13

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Re: Fast Mover Activation Chance

PostThu Apr 14, 2016 3:16 pm

If we gonna wishlist, I'd rather keep infantry out of the air group. I think the attack runs and intercepts should work differently and get rid of the reserves roll. Essentially, FM start in readiness. T1 they can attack run on a 6, no intercept. T2 they attack run on a 4, intercept on a 6. etc. This can be modified by FACs (so FAC deployed w/ LoS T1 would allow 5+ attack run, 6+ intercept.

To the original point, what are numbers of getting 1 FM when you have 2 squads of FM (2 rolls)?

My theory has been for FM to be effective you need 2 efficient* squads and the air group total pt cost needs to stay around 10% of your list. By efficient I mean decent rate of fire, so even though 2 single Corsairs could stay around 10%, they are not effective w/ 1 shot; you would want 2 Corsairs per squad (4 total). The Archangels are what lead me to these loose numbers, and I want to test double Warspear to see if the percentage could be more like 15%.
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SwordOfJustice

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Re: Fast Mover Activation Chance

PostFri Apr 15, 2016 12:50 am

chrisloomis13 wrote:If we gonna wishlist, I'd rather keep infantry out of the air group. I think the attack runs and intercepts should work differently and get rid of the reserves roll. Essentially, FM start in readiness. T1 they can attack run on a 6, no intercept. T2 they attack run on a 4, intercept on a 6. etc. This can be modified by FACs (so FAC deployed w/ LoS T1 would allow 5+ attack run, 6+ intercept.

To the original point, what are numbers of getting 1 FM when you have 2 squads of FM (2 rolls)?

My theory has been for FM to be effective you need 2 efficient* squads and the air group total pt cost needs to stay around 10% of your list. By efficient I mean decent rate of fire, so even though 2 single Corsairs could stay around 10%, they are not effective w/ 1 shot; you would want 2 Corsairs per squad (4 total). The Archangels are what lead me to these loose numbers, and I want to test double Warspear to see if the percentage could be more like 15%.


Chance of coming in turn one if you have two FM squads? Easy.

Two reserve rolls = 36 possible outcomes.
One outcome for roll of double 6 = 3% chance both come in.
Ten outcomes where you get at least one six = 28% to get one FM.

So it's very close to one in three games where your FM will make an appearance on turn one.

Then you need to roll availability for each attack run which is 87% to be available. That reduces the chance a bit.

Note: it's almost unimaginable that FAC could assist on turn one, except Resistance fighters designated as FAC in a bus as they're allowed to draw LOS while inside the bus.
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Firebat

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Re: Fast Mover Activation Chance

PostSun Apr 24, 2016 8:07 am

Its good to see that I'm not the only crazy one out there that researches and solves for the chance of success. :mrgreen:
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Sebageddon

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Re: Fast Mover Activation Chance

PostWed Jul 27, 2016 10:48 am

Hawk have said no infantry in the Air group. In my experience 1 FM is not enough to be effective but 2 or more is great, I run 2 hellhogs and they're worth their weight in gold :-)
The mighty median :-) (25th out of 50)
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Egge

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Re: Fast Mover Activation Chance

PostWed Jul 27, 2016 12:25 pm

I don't know. The Fast mover function is really cool in DZC. As long as it is on the level (or similar) as it is now. The second it becomes slightly better so that people start to consider them on regular basis they becomes really boring. Then the payment must be lowered. Today they are high risk but high reward function. If you make them standard risk and high reward the game will become one of the most boring game ever.

"Oh, so you have fast movers? So I can't shoot with my AA on your other dropships else I will automatically loose something vital in my army per turn? Yeah - I can see how this is going to be fun."

While I do think it is good the FM are on the low tier in regular power level I do miss that you do not use the models. By having the model as a marker when it becomes available on any edge on the table and if enter within 3" of that marker it does not have to roll for availability then you at least use the model on the table in each game.

But making FM overall better? There is huge risk involved.
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